Is Waterboarding Torture or is Mancow Just a Wuss?
More adventures in Celebrity Waterboarding: Chicago radio shock jock Mancow Muller volunteered to take on the critics and allowed Marine Sgt. Klay South to waterboard him on the air last Friday May 22.
Mancow lasted all of eight seconds, afterwards loudly and repeatedly proclaiming that waterboarding is “absolutely torture.”
America probably shouldn’t take a guy called Mancow as the final word on the subject, but Katie Couric, Brian Williams, Rush Limbaugh or Bill O’Reilly don’t seem to be volunteering to give it a try.
MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann got very excited and once again baited Fox News’ Sean Hannity, who hasn’t followed up on an alleged offer to be waterboarded for charity. Olbermann has instead donated $10K to Veterans of Valor, a charity run by the Marine who poured the water on Mancow.
Here’s hoping the debate continues. I’m sure that Eminem or that guy who plays Captain Kirk will have something to add to our national discussion.
Read more at Mancow’s website. Keith has another long rant about waterboarding at MSNBC. No comment yet from Sean Hannity, but check back here for updates. Original link via TMZ.
Under the Radar is commentary. We don’t report the news; we offer our take on what happened.
53 Comments
Defining torture is subjective,for example some people may think listening to Keith Olbermann is torture..and by some people I mean me. Water boarding is usually employed when you are pressed for time..as opposed to just capping somebody in the knee and dangling the morphine syringe over them as they lay..bleeding. That, in hindsight was a little barbaric..but it was employed at one time..so maybe the threat of drowning is better that a 9 slug in the knee? subjective.
I was waterboarded three times in various training situations. Its not a big deal.
Waterboarded three times in TRAINING situations? Let me get this straight, you got waterboarded in training situations and think it’s no big deal? Training is completely different than actual CIA waterboarding. If you think you can compare the two mabey you should get waterboarded for real.
Waterboarding = “Torture”. sheesh. just a trumped up accusation…waterboarding turned into posters of hooded prisoners with electric wires attached. Leftist liberal lying arseholes.
Gitmo deainees should have been shaved, force fed pork, mouths taped, put all into big jumbo jet for travel back to their homelands…then have pilots bail out over Atlantic, let them all go down with the plane.
USA to world: Sorry, we had an accident and they’re all dead.
i was a soldier , im a product of harmony church , i am infantry„„i am ashamed my country resorted to it and i think the non serving chickenhawk bastages like bill o’rielly should stfu , he hasnt a clue of which he speaks , i have no respect for him what so ever
ashamed? total BS. Just more moralizing. oldier? prolly not. prolly a big liberal feminist beyatch
Why is this question either/or ?
He was uncomfortable and felt the sensation of drowning — but to call that torture — ABSOLUTELY NOT — he is in no way disfigured, incapacitated, or scarred for life. To answer the question — WUSS
I was a Naval Aircrewman and did not get waterboarded. BUT! I volunteered to take someone elses place so he wouldn’t have to go thru it. I was named an Honor grad and I don’t care if it is or if it isn’t. Did it save American Lives? YES. Enough said.
I was a Naval Aircrewman and did not get waterboarded. BUT! I volunteered to take someone elses place so he wouldn’t have to go thru it. I was named an Honor grad and I don’t care if it is or if it isn’t. Did it save American Lives? YES. Enough said.
I too was water boarded during training and I think I lasted about 8 seconds too before I was ready to tell them anything. When that water starts entering your lungs your mind just snaps and you panic completely. On the other hand, within a few minutes after being removed from the board, I was totally back to normal again. In a nutshell, it was an extremely unpleasant experience but it was not torture. There IS a difference.
I was a Naval Aircrewman and did not get waterboarded. BUT! I volunteered to take someone elses place so he wouldn’t have to go thru it. I was named an Honor grad and I don’t care if it is or if it isn’t. Did it save American Lives? YES. Enough said.
Just wondering if it was torture punishable by prison when the Japanese did it to Allied troops in WW2 why is it not torture now?
It was torture then because it was 1945 and the Japanese were little, yellow, slant-eyed subhumans…according to the prejudice and bigotry of the day. We lunged at any excuse to punish them. Slavery was legal once, your logic begs asking the question why it isn’t anymore. Waterboarding isn’t any fun but if you want torture go to Youtube and search Taliban beheadings.
It was torture then because it was 1945 and the Japanese were little, yellow, slant-eyed subhumans…according to the prejudice and bigotry of the day. We lunged at any excuse to punish them. Slavery was legal once, your logic begs asking the question why it isn’t anymore. Waterboarding isn’t any fun but if you want torture go to Youtube and search Taliban beheadings.
Waterboarding is not torture. Wake up America. What happens to our POW’s is torture!
I was in the Coast Guard for a number of years. I spent a lot of time in the water. I was required to be in the water. Now I know you will say I made this choice…well those that comit crimes do that of their own free will. I know what it feels like to have LARGE amounts of water up the nose and in the mouth, pucking up my guts because of the water, not being able to breath because I was under water for an extended period of time.
Next thing you know, these same people that are opposed to waterboarding will require the Coast Guard…and Navy…to stop putting their people in the water, because this is torture…we should never put any person in or near water for fear that they will get water up their nose or in their mouth.
Furthermore, I have a son in the military. If he were in danger and our government had a person in custody that could get him out of a dangerious situation, or prevent him from being harmed/killed, I would expect our government to do what it takes so he could come home.
I DO NOT feel that waterboarding should be classed as torture. To me torture is withholding food/water, causing injuries, withholding medical attention…actions that can lead to death. Waterboarding DOES NOT lead to death.
Some of the people that are opposed to waterboarding say that we should stop and lead by example on a more humane way of getting information. Are you kidding? Even if we were to try to lead by example, the people that want to do harm to our people would just laugh and continue to cut our peoples’ heads off (oh, did we forget that they did that). They would continue to shoot, snipe, bomb, use women and children to do their dirty work and would laugh, because we would NEVER be able to get needed information to keep our country and people safe.
I could go on and on and on, but will stop with…WATERBOARDING IS NOT TORTURE!!!!
I was in the Coast Guard for a number of years. I spent a lot of time in the water. I was required to be in the water. Now I know you will say I made this choice…well those that comit crimes do that of their own free will. I know what it feels like to have LARGE amounts of water up the nose and in the mouth, pucking up my guts because of the water, not being able to breath because I was under water for an extended period of time.
Next thing you know, these same people that are opposed to waterboarding will require the Coast Guard…and Navy…to stop putting their people in the water, because this is torture…we should never put any person in or near water for fear that they will get water up their nose or in their mouth.
Furthermore, I have a son in the military. If he were in danger and our government had a person in custody that could get him out of a dangerious situation, or prevent him from being harmed/killed, I would expect our government to do what it takes so he could come home.
I DO NOT feel that waterboarding should be classed as torture. To me torture is withholding food/water, causing injuries, withholding medical attention…actions that can lead to death. Waterboarding DOES NOT lead to death.
Some of the people that are opposed to waterboarding say that we should stop and lead by example on a more humane way of getting information. Are you kidding? Even if we were to try to lead by example, the people that want to do harm to our people would just laugh and continue to cut our peoples’ heads off (oh, did we forget that they did that). They would continue to shoot, snipe, bomb, use women and children to do their dirty work and would laugh, because we would NEVER be able to get needed information to keep our country and people safe.
I could go on and on and on, but will stop with…WATERBOARDING IS NOT TORTURE!!!!
I think wuss. Why?
1)Mancow not properly set on an incline with head below feet.
2)Nose held (at Mancow’s request) not allowing water to enter waterway.
3)Mouth not covered, allows water to be blown out and not allowing max water to enter air way.
4)Much of water was poured on Mancow’s chin and throat. At that, he should have lasted 6 minutes.
5)No noticable signs of distress, especially with Mancow not being secured to the table.
I just have a hard time figuring if it was real or was it MEMOREX?
Drama, Drama, Drama!
I believe you do what is necessary to prevent harm to our country, To seek information whatever way is possible. From experience as a former Ranger, Most countrys do not observe the geneva convention, Other countries will get possible information whatever means they can, Not just something like waterboarding. So stop all the bullship, quit whining. Let us do our job to prevent harm to our country, our people.our freedom.
I volunteer to mma keith overbite. I would subject myself to waterboarding first to earn the shot at Oberman. Oberman is whats wrong with this country.
Mancow is obviously not a mentally tough guy. He also said himself he’s damaged goods since he already drowned as a kid. I say waterboarding should be STANDARD for all low life scumbag terror suspects.
That members of the military would doubt it is torture just astounds me. We court martialed people in Vietnam for doing it. Period.
Its only a debate because the GOP chickenhawks and their ignorant hangers on want it to be a debate.
Remember SERE School? Remember when they said THESE WERE ILLEGAL METHODS THE ENEMY WILL USE AND YOU WILL BREAK AND SAY ANYTHING?
Pretty sad when we have sheep in the military. Used to be there were honorable men in the profession. Lots of them. IF it was wrong, it was wrong. Politics didn’t make it right.
All those apologists for torture should be subjected to waterboarding most rikki tick! I really, really want to see Rush and Sean and Bill “papa bear” undergo the procedure and be asked about their love for Hillary.
I just wanna see Rush, sean and Bill “papa bear” undergo this procedure while being asked to declare their love for Hillary!
I don’t care. If it can save American lives, go for it.
I vote with chiefjgmac who says “Wuss”. I also watched the tape of Mancow, and saw what the Chief saw. Mostly BS. The “Marine” poured the water on his closed mouth and on his neck, he was not restrained. Looked like Memorex to me, sir.
It’s wrong to waterboard, but it’s okay to let thousands of people die who might be saved by timely intel. What kind of “morality is that?
Yes, to both questions—- Mancow is a wuss (because the man only lasted 6 seconds or so), and waterboarding detainees IS torture.
The U.S. considered had waterboarding to be torture for decades… up until the Bush administration wanted to use the technique. And, that fact didn
Yes, to both questions—- Mancow is a wuss (because the man only lasted 6 seconds or so), and waterboarding detainees IS torture.
The U.S. considered had waterboarding to be torture for decades… up until the Bush administration wanted to use the technique. And, that fact didn
What the Japanese did it to Allied troops in WW2 is it not the same ‘water boarding’ we did to the three terrorists.
Japanese ‘water boarding’ was to fill up your stomach and then jump on it so it all blew out again… sometimes you died… more to it than pouring a little on your face.
Look it up, history buffs, before you say the Japanese went to prison for ‘water boarding’ like we do.… it wasn’t the same technique.
The good thing about waterboarding is that the victim survives so that you can do it again until you get the answers. I think it’s a great method for interrogation in urgent situations. What’s there not to like about it?
It looks like these posts are censored. Only the “acceptable” opinions are in fact posted.
I went through SERE and got the waterboard. It was a matter of them totally restraining you then and lots of water up your nose. Also remember, you get the waterboard after many days of sleep deprevation, being in a 3X3X3 box for a day and a half in the hot sun, being tied up and hung up by your arms until they feel like they have been pulled out of your shoulder sockets (they do this for about 24 hours), and numerous hard kicks, punches, and rifle butt hits to really let you know your in enemy hands.
Once that water starts to pour into your nose and into your airway, you know you can’t breathe and it feels like you are drowning. It is a form of psychological torture because it plays with your mind that you are going to drown. It happens very fast, but it has no lasting effect once it is over. You have no nightmares from it. I hated SERE, but I hated the box in the hot sun more that the waterboard.
I think we need a way to get information from terrorists suspects and this was an effective method, but it is probably below our country to do this. It would seems that with better living through chemistry, they would have a reliable drug to administer by now to go along with sleep deprevation.
most people would not enjoy water boarding. Isnt that the point. So why is this article focused on Mancow? Its a clever tactic to divert the real issue posed at a predominantly military audience. Think about it. And try really hard to think for yourself. Did you take an oath? What did it say? Does that mean something to you? Have you read the Constitution that you have sworn to defend? You should. And you should understand the purpose. Dont be suckered into the whims of politicians and bankers. What would you do if your commander told you to do this (or any other unconstitutional thing) against your fellow Americans? Are you strong enough to resist? or are you simply a tool reacting without thought? Are all humans provided the rights we profess is granted by our maker, or has God only provided the right of Life Liberty and the pursuit of happiness to Americans? Think.
The typical backwards thinking of many American people and of course politicians. Its okay for the ragheads to cut the heads off American soldiers & civilians but its not okay to waterboard. What kind of mentality is this country coming to! We have to ask for permission when the enemy couldn’t give a sh** what they do to us. We need to smarten up and do the enemy the same way they do us.
To the writer who referred to Japanese water boarding/water torture: You have bought into talk show liberals comments who accurately cite the Japanese torture as having been determined to be illegal, extreme torture
Once again Mr. Barber you fail to impress me with your editorial skills, oh yeah don’t pay any attention to the real details! Compared to his macho verbal blustering, Mancow broke like a little girl. But I watched the same video as you, and you report an almost hysterical person; when he was only on a mental trip of a past near death experience. Interestingly, he was talking very coherently and obviously needed another real hosing down. Torture no… effective mind disruption, yes! Reading your painful commentary is torture for anyone who has served and suffered much greater than Manchild. You should give it a try, we will even let you use a snorkel.
Mancow = Wuss. Waterboarding is not pleasant. In fact, it’s downright unpleasant, but we have been using it in SERE training on a lot of our troops for years, so I wouldn’t call it torture — not by a long shot.
If Mancow drowned as a young boy and had to be revived, being waterboarded was a BAD idea for him to try
As an active duty member, currently deployed, I feel that the general public will jump on any opportunity to whine about something. When we catch criminals, we put them in jail, we interrogate and hope that our psychological tactics work to solve the crime or get a confession. Here in the AOR, time is the difference of life or death. If an attack on the scale of Sept. 11th was being planned, and it occurred because we were waiting for the captured insurgents to “break” while being confined, well then that would be a tragedy as well as another opportunity for the bleeding hearts and the media to say, “well the US gov
IMO– it’s torture.
To those who noted that what our enemies do to people is far worse? True. That what they do is worse does NOT justify illegal and immoral conduct on our part. In the long run, since this ‘global war on terrorism’ depends very much on winning hearts and minds, we are going to be much more successful if we keep the ‘moral high ground’ instead of compromising ourselves whenever it’s convenient. Also, we who are in the military are supposed to hold honor as a military virtue– I’d rather keep my honor, regardless of what my enemies do, than stoop to their level and lose my honor.
Regarding those who think it’s a good way to get information? Wrong. Torture (including waterboarding) will get someone talking when previously they kept their mouth shut. It can get you someone who’s going to tell you whatever they think you want to hear that will get you to stop torturing them– however, it will NOT get you true information– it will get you someone babbling about anything and everything, including subjects making up things when they don’t know anything, and other subjects spinning great chains of lies and BS instead of true information that they know. Some subjects will reveal true information. Some subjects will spill a mix of truth and lies, and things they know and things they made up– can you tell the difference when you’re torturing someone? No. You can’t even tell if a confession to various misdeeds is true or not (it probably isn’t) when you pried it out of someone by torturing him until he admitted guilt. So, there are a lot of practical reasons why we shouldn’t rely on or use torture, regardless of the apparent expediency.
BTW– yeah, I’ve done a tour of duty in Iraq already. I’ve seen what our enemies do to people. Having served in the warzone, I still believe torture (including waterboarding) is illegal, immoral, and (in the long if not short run) not really practical either. It is also against the Geneva conventions, which, as laws derived from signed and ratified treaties that the USA is party to, are part of OUR laws, and our duty to support and defend the Constitution requires us to uphold them as well. That our enemies don’t uphold the Geneva conventions means we should try them for war crimes whenever we catch them, find them guilty if they have violated the laws of land warfare, and punish them in accordance with the conventions– we shouldn’t follow their example.
How is it the liberals want to only ATTACK Americans and what we do? Yes we’ve water boarded and gleaned very useful information from it that has saved MANY lives. To some it may seem bad but in comparison to what our enemies do it’s a walk in the park or a party. We do it in very sanitary conditions meaning we have personnel there to insure the designated receiver does not die but can live to tell us more information on other occasions as well.
Can you say the same for our enemies? Do they have people standing by to help their victims as they hack through their necks with dull pocket knives? Do they make any effort whatsoever to take care of their victims who are innocents not even involved in the conflict?
Why is it loudmouthed morons like Oberman don’t oppose and get so mouthy to and about the real horrors of real torture like connecting electrical cables to body parts and literally burning those body parts off?
It’s very simple really… count how many people have died in our water boarding and how many have died in real torture by the radical Islamists?
Why do they loudmouth with such hypocrisy about what America does? Let me see them walk up to the enemy and ask them a polite question or give them tea and crumpets and see how much usable intel they can obtain by their methods.
In effect what they are saying is let the enemy do all kinds of crimes against humanity and it’s OK but don’t allow America and her allies do ANYTHING or they are bad and terrible people. They seem to think Americans should just stand in place and let people attack, maim and kill us and that’s OK.
Personally I say lets put these bleeding heart liberals on a bus and send them to the enemy so they can get first hand knowledge and experience about what is really bad. Do you think they will understand reality then? Will they continue to mouth off and say America is the villain as their genitals fall off in crisp ashes or as they gurgle on their blood as their neck is being sawed through with a dull knife????
STOP THE INSANE HYPOCRISY!!!
If you want to protest REAL torture, go protest the ones who are really doing the torture and killing innocents.
America trains their soldiers to be as surgical as possible to sustain only minimal collateral damage while the enemy is too cowardly to stand and fight in the open so they use innocents to hide behind as human shields and they hold innocents in places and make it look like an enemy house so when we attack to destroy the enemy there are innocents found killed because the enemy put them there to be slaughtered.
Where is the loudmouthed protests about that?
How many people who were sent to Guantanamo were killed or executed? None???
How many of our soldiers were captured by the enemy and sent to camps? None???
How many of our prisoners who were captured and sent to Guantanamo are still alive? All of the ones still there are alive and only the ones who were released and returned to fighting the war against us are dead.
How many of our troops were captured and sent to prison camps. NONE!!!!! Because they were executed or tortured (by real torture methods) and then executed in place so they had no time to be imprisoned. Not to mention the enemy doesn’t want prisoners… THEY WANT TO KILL US so they don’t take prisoners. They kill anyone even when captured. (Their whole philosophy is we’re cockroaches and they need to RAID us, just because we believe in the same God differently than they do.)
Can you honestly not see the difference here?
We strive to save the innocents and even take care of the bad guys with the finest health care available in the world.
We’re giving better health care and catered meals to these so called prisoners than we give to every day normal Americans.
Look at what they do? They get to throw feces and urine bombs on our soldiers, they get to try to hurt and kill our soldiers who are really PROTECTING them from being killed… they get their own special cuisine provided at our expense, they get to enjoy the sun and fresh sea air we all have to pay to be able to get and all they have to do is be tipped upside down a little bit and be sprinkled with some water( so there’s an even less chance of them drowning because water flows down hill still (according to the laws of gravity) so the only way they could possibly get water into their lungs is if they sucked in in and inhaled it.
Does anyone remember what the purpose is for having Prisoners of war? So they can’t return to the battlefield and continue or prolong the war????
They are only kept till after the cessation of hostilities, which is exactly what the supreme court said we can continue to do here…
So why for the love of God, are we still hearing morons screaming to release them so they can just go back to prolong the war and killing us?
Why don’t we give the bleeding heart liberals, (who want to treat the enemy so good), to the enemy so they can see first hand how GOOD the enemy really is… ON THEM.
Sounds like a plan to me.
Meanwhile… Let’s keep killing the enemy before they can kill us.
If we can get some good intel from them on the way, GOOD. Helps us to take them out and give them what they want… to meet God and see him laughing at them when they ask about their 72 virgins they thought they were going to get.
HUAAHHHHHHH!!!!!
If Kim Matheson is ashamed of our country then get the hell out. There are planes leaving every few minutes get on one!
Is it torture? It depends on if you are giving or recieving. Also, some may think it is not doe to their personal experience, however to someone that has never experienced it, it very well could be. However, are there any recorded deaths from waterboarding? Anything can be carried to the extreme. Does it compare to ripping out your nails one at a time? That is torture that has lasting effects. How long does waterboarding last?
Mancow is not a wuss, necessarily. He had drowned as a child, therefore water being poured on his nose and mouth like that reawakened that trauma. It was probably worse for him than a terrorist who had been trained since he was 12 to be a soldier.
These guys have had SEAL-like training since their childhood and have dreamed of killing Americans since that time. They have been trained for harsh interrogations like this.
Someone posted that we executed and/or sent to prison Japanese soldiers who waterboarded Americans in WWII. Sirs, it was a much more aggressive waterboarding. AND waterboarding was the least of their crimes they were charged for. They were NOT executed for waterboarding alone! The Japanese executed were charged with murder and REAL torture which is administered purely out of caprice. Kind of like “ok time to wake up” and burning the POW with a lit cigarette which leaves scars. Beating with bats, chairs, fists, bamboo, being tied and suspended with their weight bearing on their joints, being placed into small metal boxes in the hot sun. Waterboarding was probably a treat for our POWs.
WAKE UP AMERICA!!! The terrorists are attacking us in our weakest places, the media via the illiberal left and the Courts with our own sycophantic lawyers championing them.
I say Mancow is a wus. he should have taken it like a man and not surrendered.
When did we become such a sorry nation? If you can’t take it, then don’t do the crime. If you are such a baby go home mommy will take care of you. I served and I feel the liberal tree hugging pieces of junk that like to trash the United States should go live in the filth of those other countries for even a week, they wouldn’t last! Soliders have to live in tents or worse and they are fighting to secure the liberals right to be a pain in the rear! Torture isn’t a little bit of water in your face and ears and lungs it is 9/11! Remember that you mamby pambies. Here let me get you a pacificer!
I guess if that’s torture then we should all just wave the white flag and learn a new language.
If that FAKE waterboard session ( and that was FAKE as a few informed people noticed ) was torture then we should just wave the white flag and learn a new language.
J.D. Snow What ever it takes to keep America Safe and free. Waterboarding is not as bad as what they will do to you and your love ones. Currahee.
Those that say waterboarding is not torture, who are saying it is an acceptable method of interrogation, are giving implicit permission for our enemies to use it on U.S. service members!
I absolutely do not want my husband or my son waterboarded by either Iraqis or Afghanis… Because it IS torture, and it IS wrong.
No matter who does it.
And that, really, is the bottom line.